George Bush is one of these.

Look at theology, look at the last 2000 years and the conclusion:  to be baptized is to be born again.  Forget all the novel theories from the tubthumpers and goobers.

UPDATE: hotel283 You said "Might want to check your facts their Donovan. Catholics, and most Christians, believe that the rite of Baptism cleanses ones soul of the Original Sin. Nothing about rebirth." Well, no disrespect but the "FACTS" I go on are in the bible and thats all I need, read the book of John and the book of Luke. Luke 23:43 "And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise." (speaking to the thief on the cross) John 3:1 "There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews: 2The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him. 3Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. 4Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born? 5Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. 6That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again." ORIGINAL MESSAGE: Jesus was explaining being a Christian when he mentioned being "born again". To be baptized is not being "born again" but a sign to the world that you are "born again". The thief on the cross was not baptized but Jesus said he would be with him in Paradise this day. You should be baptized because you are instructed to do this but it is not a condition of salvation. aDios mentioned John 3:3, read it, it talks about being born again. To be a "Christian" and to be "born again" are one and the same, you can't be one without the other. If you don't believe me read the Bible.

Might want to check your facts their Donovan. Catholics, and most Christians, believe that the rite of Baptism cleanses ones soul of the Original Sin. Nothing about rebirth.

two birthdays and twice the presents!

All of the people I have met who were born again were complete turn offs to Christianity. Sorry but everyone who has been baptized is born again but the people who state that they are born again think that they are more special then the rest of us who consider it already said when we state I am a Christian I had a boyfriend who said he was born again and he thought he was above me because he had been Catholic, went away from the church, got mixed up in some really bad stuff and then came back again and became Born Again No nobody is more superior, in the eyes of God. He wasn't the only Born Again I have met who acted as if they were superior, I have met quite a few that turn their noses up to those of us who are mere Christians. EDIT: In the bible it states that on the day of pentecost when the disciples were speaking in tongues, they recieved the holy spirit, that JOhn baptized in water and that now they would be baptized in the holy spirit. However, to speak in tongues was not how they were baptized in the holy spirit, but rather the RESULT of such. And when they spoke in tongues, everyone from every language could understand what it is they were saying. Also, it was stated that from then on when a person was baptized, they would be baptized in the holy spirit. So like I just said. If you are baptized, you are BORN AGAIN.

I understand 'texasyankee' here. My view is similar. Most of the 'born again' folks I met in my eyes are just using religion as their new crutch. They all seem to have had a bad road before because of their inherent weaknesses. Whether it be dope or sex or some other vice, they are able to get past it by essentially being addicted to something else, in this case God/Religion. These kind of people have to be obsessive about something, thats what brought on their initial demons in the first place. So now instead of being hooked on drugs or something, now they are hooked on God. It usually means they have to preach and talk and preach a talk and convince themselves every day that they are good now instead of bad....just a cop out. If you could not find faith for the right reason, to use it as a crutch is kind of phony to me. But, anything that helps you out...more power to you. Its better to be a Jesus freak than an addict I guess.

UPDATE: Well, yes jfkbuff since you brought it up it really is nice to have the intelligence and lack of herd mentality to be able to make up my own mind concerning matters of faith. About as nice - I would imagine- as it is for you to stop by just to let us all in on who qualifies as a true Christian as opposed to the poor saps who are just deluding themselves. Im certainly not denying that one must have an honest and true faith in Christ to be a Christian. I simply dont think that you or any other person on earth is qualified to say who actually has it. You think you can define something that happens only in the human heart and soul apparently based on a term someone coined back in the sappy 70s. There is nothing worse than a group of reformed whatevers who get together, have a religious experience and then proceed to box up their own version of how it must happen. Apparently the experience causes them to become so unhinged they actually believe they have some new angle on Christianity. What they never seem to see is that instead of enlightening the world they are at best creating simply a dogma of a different color and at worst they may actually be creating yet another splintered off sect or cult. ORIGINAL POST of 5-30-05: I've always thought the term born again sounded deliberately vague and even a bit hickish; as though the person is daring someone to say something to make them feel as though theyre suffering for their faith. Im not talking about the reference in the Bible that makes sense to me simple and plainly stated. The thing that irritates me is when people grab one scriptural reference, blow it out of proportion and over-use it to the point that the original meaning becomes obscure or seems over stated. Christ was just saying that you must come to a point where you realize you truly believe in Him. I dont think its necessary to create a whole subculture of Christians who think their belief experience outranks others in its significance and I definitely dont believe that talking something to death makes it more valuable or true. Many people have come to a true faith in God who didnt find it necessary to yap about it 24-7. How does anyone but God know what goes on in the human heart? They dont.

I've met many intelligent and scholarly Christians from diverse denominations. . .but these are by far and away the dumbest and least educated sect. . .Absolutely retarded as a whole.